Discussion Forum
Hopefully everything will work smoothly for you – however, if there is something wrong, please take a moment to email us (forum@badminton-coach.co.uk) so that we can put it right !
Please do not SPAM this forum – anyone found posting non-badminton related messages or ADVERTISING without permission will be removed without notice and may be banned from using the forum in the future.
Membership of this Badminton Discussion Forum is FREE
To join, just click the Register button just BELOW on the right. Please note however that any strange email addresses (lots of random letters etc) with an obscure user name will be deleted.
Log In
Register
Home
Topic RSS 
4:08 am
June 6, 2010
Offline
Hi,
Once again I've noticed there's a subject that hasn't been explored yet. It's usually taken for granted, but without any instruction this took me about two years to figure out on my own. I think there's a reason we find a 'pro' in 'pronate', and that 'supination' supers-up your backhand power.
Well the earlier part is a lie. I was instructed, and by a wonderful player, but very briefly. I was told, for instance, that you should reach as far for shots as you comfortably can, and rotate your shoulder, elbow, and finally give a 'kick' with your wrist to get power. I haven't heard the terms 'pronate' and 'supinate' until AFTER it dawned on me. I have to give the credit to Lin Dan and Andy Roddick for this one. And a big hand for slow motion footage.
I saw slow-mo video of Roddick serving, and Lin Dan smashing. I'm not one to question top pros normally, but I found out these people were bending their elbows waaaaay too much and weren't getting the highest contact point with the ball/shuttle. I'd gone though physics 101, and the system didn't make sense at all. So like any good learner, I just went out and tried it.
Hit a few shuttles and then it dawned on me that the only way to add power was to use a rotational motion. I started doing it and my shots were more powerful than ever! What a surprise! My shuttles were flying incontrollably sideways but heck, I would have that sorted out in no time. I played around with the upwards extension versus bending for pronation/supination, checked gains and losses in power, angle, ease, etc.. Totally changed my world in minutes!
Long story short, I'd like to dedicate this thread to discussing the practicalities, technicalities and advantages of pronation and supination, and generally praise whatever force each of us believes is responsible for the wonderful mechanics we have at our disposal as human beings. Backhand and forehand baseline clears? What a joke! Powerful smashes? Suddenly possible!
So yeah. PROnation and SUPination. Talk about it here! 
9:34 am
February 15, 2011
Offline
Marc
Good subject. I recall as a junior a player demonstrating a backhand. All the books taught us to point the elbow, backhand grip and that was about it.
It took years for me to truly understand the mechanics of a backhand, because nobody was teaching it very well.
I love watching Taufik as he’s got such a brilliant powerful backhand. This is down to flawless technique, an extremely powerful rotation which also means that he can hit off the ground.
The most important ingredient for me is that he is so relaxed that he can generate the power easily even if the shuttle is behind him.
I’m looking forward to reading players comments on this subject.
Paul
10:41 pm
VIP Coaching Program Members
August 12, 2010
Offline I remember seeing a fairly advanced player assuring a lady that all the power for an overhead shot came from “the wrist”. This confuses me… did that player really believe his wrist was anything other than a joint? Surely the correct thing would be to say the power came from the forearm muscles that operate the wrist, allowing you to focus your power into the contact point. This got me thinking: so where does the power come from?
I remember reading an online article that claimed, after biomechanical testing, that 90% of the power for an overhead forehand came from the forearm rotation. It occurs to me, that in order to cock the wrist before impact, and then reach up so that the racket makes a clean contact with the shuttle (correct grip required!) is actually forcing your forearm to rotate, and the follow through encourages the complete rotation motion. So where players were claiming it all came from the wrist, it seems to me they are partially correct because to get the desired action with the correct grip, pronation must be used! One of the many problems of the panhandle grip! It discourages pronation (along with all the usual problems of using it at the wrong time!)
This same article gave the words pronation and supination, and went on to explain how “rewinding” a good forehand overhead looked suspiciously similar to a good overhead backhand, so it seems twisting one way is a forehand and the other is a backhand!
This leads me to think, should a student who is learning to hit overhead be told specifically to focus on rotating the forearm. Is it actually simpler to explain how to do a good backswing, reach up, and use the correct grip, thus forcing them to do the correct motion, than it is to explain about forearm rotation, shoulder rotation, wrist movements and all the other essentials? Obviously the learner should know what is going on, but for the purpose of learning the stroke, what is it more useful to focus on? The details? Or the shape?
And seeing as this is the discussion about pronation, refer to the racket wind up exercise in one of pauls videos (using string, a handle and some weight and winding the weight up and down), also called “the brick” by many, as a great exercise for building up the strength of pronation and supination!
Matt
1:38 am
June 6, 2010
Offline Matt,
When it comes to teaching people, I personally think it's good to chunk down, but to give specifics when it comes to grips.
I've been showing beginners how to do this and that technique, move like this, use that grip, etc, and all I managed to do was to annoy them! I didn't get it until one day when I was playing with someone and he wasn't bad – just unrefined. He had some 'lag time' after playing his shots in returning to the center. I didn't feel like teaching him stuff, so I just gave him pointers. Told him that a game should 'flow' and that it's important to keep continuous movement and to eliminate that waiting time. I tossed in something about reaching for your shots to get them earlier and with more options.
Within minutes he was playing MUCH better!
So that's my system now, and it's worked well so far. I'm no coach, but most people around here could use some instruction. The only things I'm still anal about are the grips, which I reassure them is vital and won't take long, and correct landing while lunging and, well, landing. That way the worst habits never take off, they learn very quickly and they don't injure themselves needlessly.
The rest is 'just pointers' and general advice. No pressure.
11:33 am
February 15, 2011
Offline As with all coaching, correct essentials such as grip. After that, see what happens because the body has ways to correct or create the right movement.
Whenever you ask a player to throw their racquet, as long as the right grip is in place, most of the technical aspects take care of themselves.
Matt, it’s very easy to provide too much information. The resulting effect is a player with information overload. I “walk” players through the steps to correct technique one piece at a time. This way each element of the sequence locks into place faster. So at any time, they will focus on just one thing.
Great comments again guys.
Paul
Most Users Ever Online: 676
Currently Online:
55 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
Matthew Seeley: 391
Peter Warman: 239
Ed: 186
Dobbie98: 165
gingerphil79: 158
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 10
Members: 1532
Moderators: 1
Admins: 2
Forum Stats:
Groups: 2
Forums: 8
Topics: 581
Posts: 4716
Newest Members:
vishu08, t123, LucaSchlietz, ehsianturi, wkt_1Moderators: Design: 0
Administrators: AngieS: 0, Paul Stewart: 1283
